b29651 congrats from Dan Lyons!!!

Message ID: 71922
Posted By: diogenese19348
Posted On: 2003-12-16 13:40:00
Subject: Re: b29651 congrats from Dan Lyons!!!

I suppose somebody besides me may have noticed that article was a major league hatchet job of us, right?

Message ID: 71935
Posted By: martin_lvnv
Posted On: 2003-12-16 13:50:00
Subject: Re: b29651 -- congratulations!

Remember the quote attributed to Mahatma Gandhi:

"First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they attack you, then you win."

Message ID: 71939
Posted By: diogenese19348
Posted On: 2003-12-16 13:51:00
Subject: Re: Forbes article wasn't flattering

The most annoying part to me was this line:

"Readers on both sites post responses to stories and share links to other Web sites, which is how rumors and paranoia keep spreading, unchecked. "

So exactly how is quoting from a court document, or a 8K or an S3 spreading rumors and paranoia?

Quoting Darl or Blake or Chris certainly is, but, um, who is guilty of that (cough, cough)

Message ID: 71954
Posted By: heimdal31
Posted On: 2003-12-16 14:09:00
Subject: Re: b29651 congrats from Dan Lyons!!!

<< I suppose somebody besides me may have noticed that article was a major league hatchet job of us, right? >>

Yep. However, I think it may have an unintended effect. I suspect it may get some people looking at GrokLaw who might never have showed up before.

Two things I found interesting. In his penultimate paragraph he touts our jumping to conclusions about the DDOS attack, and says that it is an example of rumors and speculation running unchecked. I thought that GrokLaw, here and Slashdot all did a good job of checking that with independent facts. I also know that Lyons knew about the checks because he had aske me for an interview. I refused, but we did keep in touch during the attack. In fact, I may have been the first person to point him to the changing reaction here and on Groklaw when the CAIDA report came out. So, he can't claim he didn't know, because he replied to my e-mails about it.

Secondly, his final paragraph is the type of paranoid rant that would make an anti-SCO poster here proud if the situation were reversed. I think he really undermines his moral high ground there.

Message ID: 71969
Posted By: b29651
Posted On: 2003-12-16 14:20:00
Subject: Re: b29651 -- congratulations!

wow
thanks for pointing it out to me
i was gone for lunch
hehehehe
br3n

Message ID: 71983
Posted By: b29651
Posted On: 2003-12-16 14:32:00
Subject: Re: b29651 -- congratulations!

the only problem is he never answers the question
he just weasels around
hehehehe
br3n

Message ID: 71987
Posted By: heimdal31
Posted On: 2003-12-16 14:35:00
Subject: Re: b29651 -- congratulations!

<< the only problem is he never answers the question
he just weasels around
hehehehe
br3n >>

br3n,

I'd love to here more detail regarding your side of the story--particularly what you mean by that comment.

Message ID: 72012
Posted By: diogenese19348
Posted On: 2003-12-16 14:54:00
Subject: Re: who else did Lyons interview?

He requested to interview me. I sent him back an e-mail saying who I was and what I was about. I never heard back from him.

I think I can see why now. I am not a Linux advocate, I just do not like what SCO is doing. I wouldn't have fit what he wanted to write about.

Message ID: 72013
Posted By: heimdal31
Posted On: 2003-12-16 14:56:00
Subject: Re: who else did Lyons interview?

<< Pretty much a hatchet job. I'm curious if anyone else was interviewed here, or Lyons just went for the major posters?>>

Mentioned this in another post, but Lyons approached me for an interview. I refused.

Besides br3n, I know of two other posters that were contacted by Lyons because I have had e-mail conversations with them related to that. I know one also refused and one was willing, but I'm not sure the interview actually took place. I will let them reveal themselves, if they want. But, I too am curious who else he asked and when. I do know that at least one of the people was contacted some weeks ago, but I don't know if that was the first contact.

Message ID: 72036
Posted By: b29651
Posted On: 2003-12-16 15:13:00
Subject: Re: who else did Lyons interview?

i dont think i was wrong to allow the interview
i answered him honestly as i could
he also asked why the kernel coders feel so strongly about linux
i told that it was like i felt about my art
it is a part of me when i create a piece of art
maybe that isnt true for the coders but that was my perspective
i told him why i love linux is because it works
i dont have to reformat constantly
that i control what gets d/l to my computer and very easily
instead of being hidden
br3n

Message ID: 72042
Posted By: heimdal31
Posted On: 2003-12-16 15:23:00
Subject: Re: who else did Lyons interview?

<< i dont think i was wrong to allow the interview
i answered him honestly as i could>>

br3n, I don't think you were wrong to allow an interview either. I refused in part because I don't think I'm a particularly useful authority to get quotes from. I had also already heard from someone else who had been contacted and suspected that Lyon's was doing a hatchet job. So, I was wary when I first heard from him.

I do think that this article will drive new users to Groklaw, and that is a good thing.

I also think that if it does give radicimo a chance to write up a good reply, that it will not reflect well on Lyons. I also suspect many here will see that as a good thing.

Message ID: 72046
Posted By: b29651
Posted On: 2003-12-16 15:32:00
Subject: Re: who else did Lyons interview?

i figured it was a hatchet job also
but if all he can say is smash mouth then i have done good
because i am very careful about what i post and never curse
i also never threatened so he really had to stretch on that
hehehehe
br3n

Message ID: 72066
Posted By: diogenese19348
Posted On: 2003-12-16 16:17:00
Subject: The Linux Army Attacks

Is now connected to the Financial Page (Geeks Revenge). Interesting rename. And thinking about it, yeah, SCO cannot be too happy with that article. This was definately FUD that should give their investors pause. And they now have all the links to here, groklaw, and Slashdot to read even more scary stuff.

Character assassination notwithstanding, I think this was a win for our side.

Message ID: 72071
Posted By: b29651
Posted On: 2003-12-16 16:20:00
Subject: Re: who else did Lyons interview?

thanks after reading this and all i sat and cried because i thought maybe i had made a big mistake and hurt linux more than helped
but then i got calm again and am ready for battle again
lians is a tiny little guy that is a blimp on the horizon
unimportant
he doesnt really understand that when all comes out he has hurt himself because we are part of the future and sco wont be here
-:)
br3n

Message ID: 72074
Posted By: diogenese19348
Posted On: 2003-12-16 16:27:00
Subject: Re: who else did Lyons interview?

<<
thanks after reading this and all i sat and cried because i thought maybe i had made a big mistake and hurt linux more than helped
but then i got calm again and am ready for battle again
lians is a tiny little guy that is a blimp on the horizon
unimportant
he doesnt really understand that when all comes out he has hurt himself because we are part of the future and sco wont be here
-:)
br3n
>>

No need to cry over it br3n. This is SOP for columnists. That was not a news story, it was an opinion piece, and Dan had in mind how he was going to slant it before he ever contacted a one of us.

And I really don't think the article was bad for us. SCO has already been harping about Linux Fanatics, this is the first time someone has written about what is actually happening.

We will see how it plays out, to early to tell right now.

-Dio

Message ID: 72100
Posted By: crunchie812
Posted On: 2003-12-16 17:12:00
Subject: Re: Stay polite to Journalists

Ah, well.... I sent the following comment to Forbes:

"As someone who has been following this case since its inception, I have been impressed by two things. One, the extraordinary weakness of the case that SCO has brought against IBM, and two, the abysmal quality of the press coverage on
this story. Very little of the vast amount of research which has been done by Pamela Jones and others has reached the mainstream press, which seems intent on an alternate reality of its own. The SCOX Yahoo! board, which is open to all,
has been unable to attract anyone who is capable of presenting a logical and coherent argument in favor of SCO. Judging from the quality of this article, I doubt Mr. Lyons would fare well in that environment.

Greg Hill"

Message ID: 72158
Posted By: b29651
Posted On: 2003-12-16 20:49:00
Subject: Re: Br3n - you did absolutely great.

thanks witefang
i sure needed to hear that
-:)
br3n

Message ID: 72163
Posted By: crunchie812
Posted On: 2003-12-16 21:08:00
Subject: Re: Br3n - you did absolutely great.

Really girl, you done good. Hmmm, he didn't contact ME! Damn, think it could be my ID?
You have his email address? Maybe we could send him a list of questions we'd like answered....

Message ID: 72167
Posted By: b29651
Posted On: 2003-12-16 21:23:00
Subject: Re: Br3n - you did absolutely great.

thanks
nope it is on the other computer
sigh
-:)
br3n

Message ID: 72169
Posted By: b29651
Posted On: 2003-12-16 21:26:00
Subject: Re: Br3n - you did absolutely great.

yep i noticed
but that is ok
i am the independent type
hehehehe
i take my knocks but i get back up
but i never forget when i get stabbed in the back
i think waht really upset me was seeing a few posts about posting irrational flames and offensive things and that i should tone it down
and needless to say it is doubtful they have even been on the board
-:)
br3n

Message ID: 72177
Posted By: cat_herder_5263
Posted On: 2003-12-16 21:40:00
Subject: Re: God Bless You Brenda Banks

I second that motion.

Keep it up, br3n! Illegitimi non carborundum.

I spend most of the day away from this board to discover the latest Forbes propaganda piece from Dan Lyons. I don't know how much lower he can sink. He must be a very spiteful bitter creature. I hope his mommy loves him, but I have my doubts.

=^^=

Message ID: 72179
Posted By: b29651
Posted On: 2003-12-16 21:45:00
Subject: Re: God Bless You Brenda Banks

thanks
i refuse to be judged by his standards as they are too low for me
-:)
br3n

Message ID: 72189
Posted By: diogenese19348
Posted On: 2003-12-16 22:20:00
Subject: Posted to Forbes

(Franky, the messages are starting to build up)

Brenda Banks is a very fine person who does not understand the stock market well. She gave a large number of quotes to Dan Lyons, he ignored all that did not fit his agenda. She never claimed to know the stock market.

We value her posts on the Yahoo! SCOX board, she is always pleasant and does not flame. The Didlio quote was frankly a cheap shot. Yes, she posted it. She meant it the way she posted it. No slur intended.

I come in somewhere under the number of posts Brenda has made, but still in the top 50. I am not a Linux advocate, a point I made to Dan, when he asked me by e-mail if I would agree to be interviewed. I do strongly disagree with what SCOX is doing.

Dan sort of overlooked the fact that most Yahoo! Business message boards are filled with abuse. I know, I have read many of them. Frankly, the SCOX one has less abuse than most, and more information. Check them out for yourselves if you want first hand knowledge.

Frankly, most of what Dan said was fact, and SCO should be very, very afraid. There are a huge number of people, many like me IT, but not Linux advocates, that want nothing to do with them at this point. We will not accept their software.

One thing he said is patently untrue: “Readers on both sites post responses to stories and share links to other Web sites, which is how rumors and paranoia keep spreading, unchecked.”

“Geek” posts always link to a hard core document. 8K, S3, 10Q, Court filing. He did catch the geeks at something they got wrong: The December DDOS attack. Yes, he is right, the community doubted the attack. When proof came out it was published, on both Yahoo and Groklaw, by the Geeks, and they sat back and apologized. Yeah, they got it wrong. Yeah, they admitted it. Immediatly. Again, go to the boards in question an look it up yourself.

The hard part of this is that SCO is lying. Provably.. Repeatedly. And Dan did not bring it up. Check the sites for details an links, but let me bring up a few: SCO claimed they were going to audit AIX users in June. Didn’t happen. SCO claimed they were going to send out invoices in August. Didn’t happen. SCO claimed they had a bullet proof case. Some “infringing” code leaked. It was debunked. SCO claimed Boies is on contingency he isn’t. Never was. Check the last 8K filing to the SEC.

Yes, Dan is correct. SCO IS hated. By a large number of people. Many are not in the Linux camp (We use AIX folks. Wonder why my company hates SCO?)

SCO should be afraid, very afraid. But not just from the Linux camp.

-Dio

Message ID: 72196
Posted By: b29651
Posted On: 2003-12-16 22:32:00
Subject: Re: Posted to Forbes

he just doesnt grok it
br3n

Message ID: 72197
Posted By: diogenese19348
Posted On: 2003-12-16 22:34:00
Subject: Re: Posted to Forbes

<< he just doesnt grok it
br3n >>

No, it appears he does not. Sorry ma'am.

I will try to stay diplomatic with Forbes tonight.

-wink-

-Dio

The texts of these Yahoo Message Board posts have been licensed for copying and distribution by the Yahoo Message Board users "diogenese19348", "martin_lvnv", "heimdal31", "b29651", "crunchie812", "cat_herder_5263" under the following license: License: CCL Attribution-NonCommercial-ShareAlike v2.0.